Transcription

Chris
Hey, Jeff, I got a question for you. Yes? Are you a player?

Jeff
Not really.

Chris
Well, today. Today. I love how you just immediately said nope, nope, nope. But today we’re talking about all the players in the story, right? Who are the people who are the main players? That’s what we’re talking about.

Jeff
That’s right. People and events in, uh, in the book revelation and throughout the rest of the end times. So he’s Chris and I’m Jeff and we’re the Bible player.

Chris
All right. Well, Jeff, today we are given, uh, a list of who’s most likely. Oh, these are fun. Now, if you’re watching as opposed to listening, then you’ll see that we have paddles in our hands. And, uh, we have Jeff on one side, and then the good looking guy on the other side. And so it’s our job to hear and then hold up who we think is most likely.

Jeff
My picture looks like I’m about to sneeze.

Chris
You think? Oh, it really does. Yeah, it really does. And mine. I’m explaining something I think. Yes. Yep. So here we go. Okay, so number one who’s most likely this is funny. Who’s most likely to eat something off of the ground? Me I’d say me too. Really? Oh, yeah. You’ll eat off the ground. I totally have the five second rule.

Jeff
Oh, I have, like, the 35 second rule.

Chris
Do you remember the episode of Seinfeld when George Costanza ate the donut in the garbage? Yes. Somebody had set the eclair on the top of the garbage, but he’s like, it was right on top.

Jeff
He’s right on top. And then you touch anything. Yeah, I totally agree with him on that whole episode, by the way. That’s great.

Chris
Okay here we go. Number two, who’s most likely to take days to reply to a text?

Jeff
Jeff.

Chris
That’d be Jeff. Yes. I don’t know if you know this or not, but I reply almost always immediately, yeah, yeah, you reply, you play quickly. Yeah. Very quickly. Uh huh.

Jeff
So it’s because your phone is an appendage. Yeah yeah, well, that’s my family. And you say, and you’ve taught everybody that that is their leash. They can yank that leash whenever they want. Yeah, yeah. And and everybody’s figured out my phone is not my leash. And I’ll check it when I want to. I’ll get back to you. Right?

Chris
Right. Yeah. Well there’s benefits. There’s definitely benefits and drawbacks to both.

Jeff
Right. If you need me really bad, call me because I’ll answer if you call.

Chris
So that’s good. All right. Number three, who’s most likely to plan the best birthday party? Chris. Yeah, that’s definitely me.

Jeff
Yeah yeah yeah yeah.

Chris
So I, I definitely love planning surprises and detailed things for my family especially. Yeah. And, uh, I’ve done my share of things, uh, you know, that when at one time when I was dating my wife, I rented a U-Haul. And in the back of the U-Haul, I. First of all, I backed it up to, like, a lake and a beautiful scene. And then in the U-Haul, I put a, um, fine dining table with candles and everything else, and everything was in this U-Haul. And then I brought her to it and then opened the U-Haul door, and we had this beautiful candlelit dinner, and then I just hauled it away.

Jeff
Look how nice.

Chris
I can give you, like, 17 of those creative dating ideas. So I liked all of that stuff.

Jeff
That’s great.

Chris
So here we go. Number four, who’s most likely to sleepwalk throughout the night.

Jeff
Oh not me. It’s got to be you.

Chris
I don’t know who to put here. I guess I’ll put me because I do get up in the night, but it’s usually to use the restroom.

Jeff
Yeah, dude, I am shocked when it’s time to wake up like somebody. If if my alarm goes off, it startles me. If if somebody touches me, I’m ready to fight. I’m so deeply asleep. Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah, that I don’t. Yeah. Well, then I don’t move.

Chris
Even though I don’t sleepwalk. It would probably be me. Yeah.

Jeff
It’s not gonna be me.

Chris
Um. I’m dead.

Jeff
I’m dead to the world. And I resurrect every morning.

Chris
So. So one more quick reference. Uh, Big Bang Theory. Uh, Bob Hope was, uh, playing an old man and Sheldon. Sheldon knocks on the door. No, not Bob Hope. Newhart.

Jeff
Oh, Bob Newhart and, uh.

Chris
And Bob. Uh, Sheldon knocks on the door, and he goes, uh. And he goes, no, I was up. He goes, well, I have to go to bed now. He goes, I have to go to bed because he goes in about two hours. He goes, I have to get up to pee and then just wander around the house. He’s like, he’s like a 90 year old man, right? Because that’s what they do. Yeah. All right. Number five, who’s most likely to own a pet chicken? Oh, there’s no question.

Jeff
I’ve already owned pet chicken.

Chris
It’s. I know it’s you. Yep. You got a whole story about chickens.

Jeff
It’s great.

Chris
Yeah. In our county, I won.

Jeff
I won against the city to have chickens at my house.

Chris
That is hilarious. Yep. All right, well, we’re gonna go ahead and move on, and we’re going to move right back into, uh, the people and the events of the end times. And we’ll be doing this for several days.

Jeff
Oh, yeah. Yeah, this is pretty much it. The first couple days we were laying the foundation trying to encourage people. Now it’s we’re getting into the the nitty nitty gritty. Um, and again, just to remind you, don’t, you know, watch out for polarization. There’s people who have very strong opinions about the things we’re going to talk about. Yeah. Stronger opinions than are reasonable because yeah, we’re just gonna leave it at that.

Chris
Yeah. And another disclaimer is that we are the Bible guys and we don’t claim to be theologians or professors. Uh, we are two guys that know the Bible. Yeah. And, uh, teach the Bible. Yeah. And so we like to talk about the Bible. Yeah.

Jeff
So it is, uh, this is almost certainly on a casual level is what we’re doing in this.

Chris
Yeah, yeah. And so we’re not covering revelation, uh, in detail. And we’re also not going, uh, from chapter to chapter. What we’re doing is, is we’re saying these are the highlights. These are the main events. Let’s talk about what we know is coming and generalizations. Because to be honest with you, revelation people are the ones who comment the most. They’ll comment forever and they have the strongest opinions. Yes, yes.

Jeff
So what we’re going to say is, um, we’re going to kind of take what would be the mainstream view. The majority of Christians globally and historically have believed along these lines, uh, for the last thousand years. But, um, uh, we are accepting of the fact that there are minority groups of theologians that would differ with these things. Right? Sure. And so we’re we love them, and we’re fine with the fact that they have a different opinion on these things. Absolutely. So, uh, the first one and by far the most controversial one would be, uh, what is called the rapture of the church. Although the word rapture of the church doesn’t exist, that phrase doesn’t exist in the Bible. This idea, rapture is the Latin for caught up, caught up in the air. Yeah, yeah. And there’s differing differing views on this. So some people believe in a rapture that happens before the tribulation.

Chris
Tribulation different than a raptor.

Jeff
Yeah. Rapture and rapture is two different things.

Chris
Yeah, two different things.

Jeff
Very astute Chris. Yeah.

Chris
One of them, Chris Pratt, works with. That’s right. That’s the other one is the Second Coming. That’s right, the rapture. Yeah.

Jeff
So Velociraptor. Velociraptor. Yeah, yeah. Um, so then, uh, boy, you got me distracted there. So there are some who believe there’s a tribulation. We’re gonna talk about that in a minute. The tribulation is the bad part. Seven years really, really bad. Yeah. Some people believe that the rapture of the church happens before the bad stuff happens.

Chris
Yeah. Which is, which is pre right. That’s pre tribulation of pre-tribulation. That’s referring to how all the Christians uh will be exempt from all the trials and tribulations of the seven years because they get, uh, raptured up before that happens, caught up bodily to heaven.

Jeff
Yes. That’s right Uh, then there’s people who believe in a mid-trib, uh, because that’s clearly divided with three and a half years and three and a half years.

Chris
That’s right. And in the Bible they describe, you know, 1420 days or whatever it is, uh, 14, 42 months. You know, I mean, it lists very clearly.

Jeff
And the first three and a half years, it’s pretty good, right? There’s a lot of global stability and wealth and all those kinds of things. And so people are like, hey, we want to go in the middle. I don’t want to miss the good part. Right. Uh, so some people have like a middle of the tribulation, uh, view. Others would have a post tribulation, meaning the Christians will go all the way through it. And it’s because the Bible talks about martyrs and things. And so there’s some people who believe that there’s a, that the rapture happens at the end of the tribulation or after the tribulation, and that there’s just one time that all of, of a resurrection. And then there’s some people who don’t believe in any rapture at all. They’re called a tribulation or, you know, no rapture. Right But, um, that’s not, uh, that’s probably the most obscure of all of the different views. So the majority of Western Christians would say that they’re pre-trib. They believe in the future. So, uh, that’s we tried to give that as fair of a of a thing. I would, I would land, I think I would land pre-trib. I’d be content with mid-trib and I’m ready for post. That’s how I describe it.

Chris
Just be prepared.

Jeff
Yeah. Just be ready.

Chris
Be prepared.

Jeff
Yeah, yeah. What about you? Where do you fall?

Chris
Yeah, I lean toward, uh. Well, you know, we were raised and taught the same way, and I. And when I look and more importantly, uh, pre-trib makes sense to me. So, uh, regardless of, you know regardless of whether or not the first three and a half years are different than the last three and a half years. Uh, I think that it just makes sense. Yeah. So I would lean that way, but again, I, I’m not committed to it.

Jeff
Um, so this idea of the rapture is Jesus coming back and getting his people right. That’s really what it is. In John 14 three, Jesus said, when everything is ready, I’ll come and get you. So that you will always be with me where I am.

Chris
By the way, can I tell you why I’m not committed to it? I just felt like I had to follow up on that comment. Go ahead, go ahead. Because I don’t think it matters that much. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So whether or not I get, you know, raptured before the three and a half years or after the three and a half years, right. Or even post three and a half years. Right. Like, like, you know, you sort of said, you know, be ready. Yeah. You know, you know, here we go. Buckle up. Yeah. A lot of these things for me because I’m such an application person. I’m like, well, whether how it how it plays out, it’s going to happen is how it’s going to play out.

Jeff
Yeah. I’m not in charge of this.

Chris
Right. I’m not in charge of it. Right.

Jeff
I just don’t think it’s going to matter other than it’s not like you stepped up to the counter and said, I’d like a pre-tribulation rapture ticket, right?

Chris
Right yeah.

Jeff
I’m sorry, we’re out of pre-tribulation tickets. Here’s a post trip.

Chris
But, but but when I say it doesn’t matter, I don’t mean that the truths themselves don’t matter. Because I’m not. I’m. I don’t mean it doesn’t matter in the sense of the word. They’re not important, right? What I’m saying is for me, it doesn’t matter, right? Because I’m saying, like, it’s not going to make a difference in my life.

Jeff
Sure. Right.

Chris
Yeah. Because how it plays out is how it’s going to play out.

Jeff
Yeah. So he says he’s going to come and get you when he’s ready. That’s right. That’s when he’s ready. Not when you’re ready when he’s ready. Right. So so, uh, Matthew 24, Jesus says, and then at last, the sign that the Son of Man is coming will appear in the heavens. We already talked about that sun, moon and stars. All that crazy.

Chris
Yeah.

Jeff
And there will be deep mourning among all the peoples of the earth, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and glory. And he will send out his angels with a mighty blast of a trumpet, and they will gather his chosen ones from all over the world, from the farthest ends of the earth in heaven.

Chris
There it is.

Jeff
There you go. So he’s gathering his chosen ones. They’re he’s he’s gathering believers. Right. And so some people would say that that’s only in connection to the final return of Christ, the Second Coming, which is different. Um, this one, though, doesn’t say he comes to earth. This one says he’s in in in heaven. Right? So anyways, who knows. And then but it does say he’s coming and there’ll be a mighty trumpet blast. And Gabriel’s going to let her fly on the horn and he’s going to bring his people home. Uh, first Thessalonians chapter four says, and now, dear brothers and sisters, we want you to know what will happen to the believers who’ve died so that you will not grieve like people who have no hope. For since we believe that Jesus died and was raised to life again, we also believe that when Jesus returns, God will bring back with him the believers who have died. We tell you this directly from the Lord. We who are still living when the Lord returns, will not meet him ahead of those who have died. For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the believers who have died will rise from their graves, and then together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And then we will be with the Lord forever. So encourage each other with these words. Um, so the the idea here is he he’s wanting to cover the fact that the that the rapture is not just for the living, it’s also for the those, uh, believers who’ve already died ahead of us.

Chris
Yeah. And so there’s and there’s different views on this too, right? Sure. So and by the way, it’s, uh, people some people believe that heaven is not immediate, as we understand it, is that like, people die, they go into the earth, and then actually heaven is reserved for this moment. Yeah, right. But because God exists out of time and space uh, it’ll be immediate.

Jeff
So other, other parts of the Scripture, Hebrews says, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

Chris
Right. That’s what I was about to quote. Right. So so it’ll seem immediate to me, but, uh, but but the time is we know it. It’s not immediate. Right. So, so there’s, there’s there’s all sorts of nuances that are attached to this theologically.

Jeff
We’re just not going to fight it.

Chris
Yeah. We’re not going to fight. No, we’re not going to fight it. And again, this is where this is where I know it sounds funny, but it doesn’t matter to me.

Jeff
Yeah. Right.

Chris
Exactly. So it doesn’t matter to me because because like listen, that’s why I don’t care to fight it. Right? Because here’s, here’s what I know. When I die, immediately I’m going to be with the Lord. Right? So so how that plays out for my dust of my body. Sure. I don’t really care, right? Right. I just know that, like, uh, you know, by the way, so. So the rapture is God comes for his people. And then this describes, uh, the second coming, coming back, uh, after the seven years. Right. God comes with his people, right? Right, right. So, you know he comes for the church, comes with the church. Right? And so anyway, I, I do believe that, uh, the visual here is, again, just something that’s supposed to be, again, intimidating, but at the same time, very comforting for us.

Jeff
That’s right. And really, one of the other evidences that people would point to for a pre-tribulation rapture would be that in the book of Revelation, churches aren’t really mentioned after, uh, revelation, what, three, I believe. Um, and it seems to be that the churches from that point on, the tribulation happens and churches aren’t referenced anymore. The believers aren’t referenced anymore, only martyrs are referenced. But no, no, uh, church, no Holy Spirit referenced in the in the in the world at that time.

Chris
Which raises another question. Will there be converts and then martyrs in the time?

Jeff
Yeah, yeah.

Chris
During that time. So what martyrs are we talking about?

Jeff
Yeah, we’ll talk about that.

Chris
Martyrs later. Old or martyrs of, you know, new martyrs, martyrs in the tribulation.

Jeff
Right. The 144,000 I mentioned that way. But yeah. So we’ll talk about that. So here’s the issue though with regard to a rapture. When it will happen shouldn’t detract from the fact that it will happen. Right? There will be a time when Jesus comes back. There will be a time when the trumpet blasts. There will be a time when all of his saints are go to heaven with him. Right? So when, uh, shouldn’t detract from the assurance that it will now what do you think is going to happen? How will the governments of the world explain what happened to 2 billion Christians just disappearing all at one time?

Chris
Yeah. You know, it’s just I don’t know, but I have a feeling that, uh, aliens will be involved.

Jeff
Oh, I totally think that that’s going to be the argument. They’re going to say. Oh aliens took everybody. Yeah, right. Well, again, what other what other what other claim could you make.

Chris
No, you couldn’t you couldn’t make any other claim besides that. Right. Uh, maybe, uh, maybe vaccines.

Jeff
Yeah. Well, vaccines didn’t make everybody disappear. I’m just kidding. Yeah.

Chris
I was trying to think of, like, something hilarious to say. Right. Uh, but I think that’s what’s going to be.

Jeff
I think we’re being conditioned for it now.

Chris
Yeah, yeah. The aliens.

Jeff
Yeah, yeah.

Chris
Well, I mean, again, it’s just it’s the we talked about it a couple of podcasts ago, but like, uh, when you see all these signs, there will be people connecting the dots and saying, see, this is the book of revelation. Yeah. But then, uh, then there’ll be people who so don’t believe in God. They’re going to say, of course you’re going to say that, right? Right. Because there is a logical explanation for it.

Jeff
The logical explanation is aliens. Yeah. Well, I mean, well, that’s that’s what they’re going to do though, right? That’s what they’re going to say. I really believe that’s what they’re going to say.

Chris
You know, it’s it’s it’s certainly logical to. Yeah. To uh, I would think half of the world or more.

Jeff
Sure. Absolutely.

Chris
They believe in aliens

Jeff
Yeah. Well, so most of the world just believes whatever the experts say and what the science leads to, by the way. So all they have to do is have a couple scientists get on TV and go, this is what we believe, and shame on you. Don’t. You’re not allowed to post anything on Facebook or Twitter that’s any different from what we just told you it was. Aliens. Quit arguing with us.

Chris
Hey, uh, by the way, uh, we don’t have that much time, but just really quickly. Do you believe in aliens?

Jeff
No.

Chris
Yeah. So. So, uh, so the, uh, my college professor, I think I mentioned this way back in he daily. Yeah, yeah, my college professor pointed out that in Genesis it said he created the stars and the hosts of them. Yeah, yeah. So he said, so there’s room for aliens. But at the same time, theologically, it doesn’t make any sense. Right. And like that. But like, uh, I also heard another, uh, hero of mine, Louie Giglio, talking about, to be clear, the the hosts, that Hebrew word is the huge number of them.

Jeff
Yeah. The hosts, the hosts would be the huge number of.

Chris
Right, right, right.

Jeff
Implying that there are more stars than you can see. Is is what what which is true?

Chris
That that’s which seems to be what the Hebrew word is saying, which is along the same lines where he says, a host of heavenly angels.

Jeff
That’s right. It’s not talking about the hostesses and the hosts of the, you know. Right. Welcome to our star. It’s not talking about that.

Chris
Right. Which we would say if aliens landed on Earth on this star.

Jeff
No. If they landed on if they landed on this planet, we’d shoot them. That’s what we put.

Chris
Well, we try anyways.

Jeff
Go ahead.

Chris
Anyway, the, uh. But then I saw one of my heroes, Lou Giglio. Talk about, uh, if if God’s billboard was the universe. Yeah. To remind us of how big he is and how small we are. Yeah. Then he’s done a good job. You did a great job. Because. Because if it’s a if creation is supposed to reflect, uh, the creator. Yeah. Then an infinite and expanding universe that we will never get to see the ends of that reminds us of how big God is. Yeah. And it can’t be big enough. Right? So if you think about it that way, then then it makes total sense.

Jeff
Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. So you have this rapture that happens. Uh, most Christians believe it happens before what we call the tribulation begins. Now the tribulation lasts seven years. It’s divided. We’ve already said this divided into two, three and a half year segments. And during that time, many things happen. Most of what we talk about next happens over the next few days, happens during the tribulation. So we can’t cover it all right now, but we’ll just start dealing with issues that happen. One of the very first things that happens is, um, it talks about how the the governments of the world begin to trample the holy city. They trample the holy city for 42 months. That’s three and a half years. And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they’ll be clothed in burlap and will prophesy during those 1260 days. Uh, so some people believe that those witnesses.

Chris
So that’s revelation 11.

Jeff
Yes. Revelation chapter 11. Some people believe those witnesses are Elijah and Moses, um, uh, or Enoch and Moses. We don’t know. The Bible doesn’t say, but it seems to be resurrected prophets. It seems to be uh, who is prophesying outside Jerusalem. And the whole world will be able to see it. Yeah. And then, um, they get assassinated right in front of the whole world. The whole world sees their bodies, sees them being assassinated, and nobody picks up their bodies. They just lay outside the city during that time. Well, in John’s day when he wrote this, he couldn’t fathom how the whole world and everybody on the planet could see it. But you and I carry a TV in our pocket, right? We could see it. Tick tock. My daughter would see it in five minutes after it happened. Right? Right. Uh, so. So it’s different now than then. So we’re closer, and then it goes on and it says in chapter 11 it says. But after three and a half days, God breathed life into them, and they stood up. So he resurrects these two prophets that get assassinated. And terror struck all who were staring at them. And then a loud voice from heaven called out to the two and prophets and said, come up here. And they rose to heaven in a cloud as their enemies watched. Yeah, this is the last. Great! These are my people. Let me get your attention one more time. Moments. This is God’s like final warning to the world. And the whole world watches these two dudes ascend to heaven.

Chris
And this among all of the signs is a crystal clear explanation. This is not figurative.

Jeff
It’s not vague.

Chris
It’s not. It’s not metaphorical. That’s right. This is very specific. Like this is going to happen because he’s talking about the two humans, two prophets. Uh, he mentions a specific city. Uh, he talks very specifically about the number of days and the literal heaven. So all of that to say, uh, other things in revelation may symbolize things. Right? But we believe that this is a sign that is pretty crystal clear.

Jeff
If you ever watching on your phone or on TV and you see two guys get assassinated outside the city of Jerusalem, and three days later they rise from the dead, and then you hear God shout from heaven, buckle up, come on up. And then they ascend to heaven on a cloud. It’s happening.

Chris
Yeah, yeah, I’m pretty sure it’s happening. Yeah.

Jeff
You need to fall to your knees, repent of your sins and call on Jesus. But you know what the world’s going to say. It was aliens, right? Right. That’s what the world’s going to say. It was E.T.. So I think we’re going to have to wrap up here. You don’t think so? I think we want to just read through this. I do. Okay, well, let me read through revelation chapter 12, because there’s this little pause and it kind of summarizes the spiritual war that’s happening between Satan the dragon. Yeah. And Jesus, even at his birth, we think of the, the, the Nativity as the cute little baby in the manger. But this is pretty crazy. Here’s what he says. Then I witness this is in revelation 12. Then I witnessed in heaven an event of great significance. I saw a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon beneath her feet, and a crown of 12 stars on her head. She was pregnant, and she cried out because of her labor pains and the agony of giving birth. And then I witnessed in heaven another significant event. I saw a large red dragon with seven heads and ten horns, with seven crowns on his heads. His tail swept away one third of the stars in the sky, and he threw them to the earth. He stood in front of the woman as she was about to give birth, ready to devour her baby. As soon as it was born, she gave birth to a son who was to rule all the nations with an iron rod, and her child was snatched away from the dragon, was caught up to God to his throne, and the woman fled into the wilderness, where God had prepared a place for her for 1260 days. Then there was war in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon and his angels, and the dragon lost the battle and he and his angels were forced out of heaven. This great dragon, the ancient serpent called the devil or Satan, the one deceiving the whole world, was thrown down to earth with all his angels. Then I heard a loud voice shouting across the heavens, it has come at last salvation and power, and the kingdom of our God, and the authority of his Christ. For the accuser of our brothers and sisters has been thrown down to earth, the one who accuses them before our God day and night. And they have defeated him by the blood of the lamb and by their testimony. And they did not love their lives so much that they were afraid to die. Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who live in the heavens, rejoice. But terror will come on the earth and the sea. For the devil has come down to you in great anger, knowing that he has little time.

Chris
So we don’t have a ton of time to unpack this. There’s a million things, a million things in there. But let me say 2 or 3 sentences. Number one is that as we read revelation, it may seem so scary, but at the same time, this gives us an indication that things are always scary in the spiritual realm. Yeah, yeah. Right, right. So this is describing the birth of Christ. You know. You know, there’s so much in there with sweeping away one third of the stars, talking about one third of the angels going down with the devil and all these kind of things. Yeah. Uh, but then also war in heaven. War in heaven. Uh, but but again, it’s just, it’s another thing that just, uh, lets us know that, uh, that God’s in control. Always and even though there are evil forces, uh, God wins. He’s always won. He won this battle. He’s not going to lose. And, uh, and it’s just it’s a great thing to be able to look at the birth of Christ and see it in this way, that there was actually a battle that took place. Yeah. Uh, as, as as Mary was giving birth to Jesus

Jeff
And the Bible says that the devil loves to accuse believers. The guilt doesn’t always come from God, right? Once you’ve had your sins forgiven, guilt comes from the devil. He loves to accuse you, but it says they, the people that he’s accused have defeated him by the blood of the lamb and by the word of their testimony. The two bullets in your gun to defeat Satan is the fact that Jesus shed his blood for you, and the story that God’s told in your life. Those are the two bullets that knock Satan out every time. Wow.

Chris
Right. Well, uh, our time has come to an end, and so we will see you hopefully tomorrow on The Bible Guys.