Transcription

Connor:
You’re listening to The Bible Guys, a podcast where a couple of friends talk about the Bible in fun and practical ways.

Chris:
We’re the best of friends. There you go. We are the best of friends.

Jeff:
I don’t know what that’s from.

Chris:
I just made it up.

Jeff:
Oh, OK. Well, that’s even more special. Did you just sing me a song about being best friends? I did, Jeff.

Chris:
Wow. I almost said Jeffy.

Jeff:
So that is a perfect segue into, we have a segment called the best friends trivia, which by the way, it’s a touch touch presumptuous, but yeah, yeah, right.

Chris:
Well, the reason why I said those things is because I read it and I go, what? This is a brand new segment. We’ve never done this one.

Jeff:
That’s right. That’s right. So here’s what Desiree wrote. While there’s no duo quite like Jeff and Chris, There are some pretty good best friend duos out there. Yes. So let’s see if Chris can determine which popular best friend said each quote. And so I’m going to read the quote and I’ll give you the two best friends.

Chris:
Okay. Okay.

Jeff:
That’s by the way, I, I, this is new to me and I hope I can, or do you want me to give you the best friends and then read the quote? Or do you want to try to guess the quote before I even give you the two best friends?

Chris:
You give me the quote, and I will see if I know the best friends. Before, yeah, yeah. And then, then I probably won’t. Okay. And then you tell me who, and then I’ll guess the person. Okay. How about that?

Jeff:
Hands down, this is the best day of my life, and quite possibly the last.

Chris:
Oh, I already know that. I’ve watched that a thousand times. I know, I know, I know you have. That is, uh, Olaf says that.

Jeff:
Olaf.

Chris:
Olaf on Frozen, right?

Jeff:
Who’s his best friend?

Chris:
Uh, geez, I don’t know. Uh, Olaf’s best friend.

Jeff:
Anna. Anna. There you go. Anna. Okay. Very good.

Chris:
They chose, wait a minute. Olaf’s best friend was Anna.

Jeff:
That’s, that’s the, that’s what she, that’s what I didn’t write these dude. I’m just reading them. I got the quote. Take the point, man. It’s a win.

Chris:
It’s definitely a win, but I just would not have chose.

Jeff:
I guess this one, this one, this one will work. Okay. We’re a team. Nothing means more to me than our friendship.

Chris:
That could be anyone at any time and anywhere. We’re a team. Nothing means more to me than this friendship. So that’s a one’s overbearing. I don’t know. I don’t want to waste anybody’s time.

Jeff:
So it’s either Sully or Mike.

Chris:
Oh, that’s hilarious. Well, who is more enthusiastic? Mike would have been more enthusiastic. I’m going to say Mike.

Jeff:
Mike. It is Mike. Oh, awesome. Good job. Good job. You’re two for two. All right. Okay. Only a true friend would say something that cruel and honest.

Chris:
That sounds familiar. It is. Only a true friend would say something that true and honest.

Jeff:
That cruel and honest.

Chris:
That cruel and honest. I don’t know.

Jeff:
Who is it? It’s either Donkey or Shrek.

Chris:
Oh, that’s funny. That would, duh. Shrek is the mean one, so it has to be Donkey.

Jeff:
There you go. No, you didn’t get me. If you get me, you kill me. I don’t know that one. I’ve never heard that quote, but I know the people.

Chris:
I don’t, to be honest, that didn’t ring a bell.

Jeff:
It’s either Joey or Chandler.

Chris:
Okay. And read it again.

Jeff:
No, you didn’t get me. If you get me, you kill me.

Chris:
Okay, I know Joey and Chandler very, very well. Yeah. And just based on the fact that that does not even remotely sound like a Joey quote, I’m going to say Chandler.

Jeff:
Yes, it is Chandler.

Chris:
Yes! Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was the one. It’s the logic right there. That could have been.

Jeff:
I didn’t know that. I don’t even know that quote.

Chris:
I don’t know either.

Jeff:
I know this one. I know this one. Okay. He has gone from completely hopeless to simply miserable. Wow. Yeah. These are tough ones. These are tough. This is why I have to give you the names. You want the names? Yes. It’s either Dwight or Jim.

Chris:
Oh, that’s hilarious. And I know the office very well. Yeah. Okay. Say it again.

Jeff:
He has gone from completely hopeless to simply miserable.

Chris:
He’s gone completely hopeless. That’s very mean. And so my guess is that Dwight said it about Jim.

Jeff:
It’s Dwight. Yes. There you go. You got them all. And you piece it together, dude. Without even knowing it. Yeah. Yeah. Donkey Chandler and Dwight. Yeah. Yeah. And Mike. You got Mike too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All piecing them together. Fantastic. It’s your instincts are just that good. You know these personalities so well.

Chris:
I know the characters. You’ve used your time wisely.

Jeff:
I know the roles that they play. That’s right. Yeah, I do think it’s funny. I made that joke about cartoons. Yeah, and then three of the five were from cartoons.

Chris:
In the moment, I’m making waffles.

Jeff:
Okay, so best friends right there, that’s what that’s all about and Apparently we’re keeping the show up pretty good because Desiree thinks we’re like best friends. Oh, that’s pretty sweet. Yeah, how nice oh

Chris:
Okay. Oh, wait a minute. That is a song. We’re the best of friends. And it’s from a cartoon. Yes. That is a song sung by mama owl in the Fox and the hound. Wow. From 1981.

Jeff:
There you go. Look how wonderful you are.

Chris:
The best of friends. Hey, if somebody doubts me, Google it. I’m telling you, I nailed it. You nailed it. We’re the best of friends. That’s what it is.

Jeff:
Okay. So you didn’t write that song for me in the moment.

Chris:
I sing it from my heart, Jeff.

Jeff:
You sing it from your heart? Yes. Okay. Okay. We are reading from John chapter 13, one through 20. And this is mine and Chris’s favorite passage in the entire gospels. This whole story. We just, if we could relive this story every day,

Chris:
And you’re going to find out why that is not a true statement as soon as we read it.

Jeff:
John 13.1 says, Before the Passover celebration, Jesus knew that His hour had come to leave this world and return to His Father. He had loved His disciples during His ministry on earth, and now He loved them to the very end. It was time for supper, and the devil had already prompted Judas, son of Simon Iscariot, to betray Jesus. Jesus knew that the Father had given him authority over everything and that he’d come from God and would return to God. So he got up from the table, took off his robe, wrapped a towel around his waist, and poured water into a basin. And then he began to wash the disciples’ feet, drying them with the towel he had around him. When Jesus came to Simon Peter, Peter said to him, Lord, are you going to wash my feet? Jesus replied, You don’t understand now what I am doing, but someday you will. No, Peter protested. You will never, ever wash my feet. Jesus replied, Unless I wash you, you won’t belong to me. Simon Peter exclaimed, then wash my hands and my head as well, Lord, not just my feet. Jesus replied, a person who has bathed all over does not need to wash except for the feet to be entirely clean. And you disciples are clean, but not all of you. For Jesus knew who would betray him. That is what he meant when he said not all of you are clean. After washing their feet, he put on his robe again and sat down and asked, do you understand what I was doing? You call me teacher and Lord, and you’re right because that’s what I am. And since I, your Lord and teacher, have washed your feet, you ought to wash each other’s feet. I have given you an example to follow. Do as I’ve done to you. I tell you the truth. Slaves are not greater than their master, nor is the messenger more important than the one who sends the message. Now that you know these things, God will bless you for doing them. I’m not saying these things to all of you. I know the ones I’ve chosen, but this fulfills the scripture that says, the one who eats my food has turned against me. I tell you this beforehand so that when it happens, you’ll believe that I am the Messiah. I tell you the truth, anyone who welcomes my messenger is welcoming me. Anyone who welcomes me is welcoming the Father who sent me.” Wow. There it is. Okay, it’s our favorite because… Because I hate feet.

Chris:
I hate feet more than life itself. So my wife’s feet are the only feet that can come near me. And even then, if I’m sitting there on the couch and she grabs her bare feet and she puts them up on me, every instinct is like, get your feet off of me. And if she says, hey, just rub my feet or something, I’m like, that’s cool. It’s my wife’s feet. I can rub her feet, right? And I’m sure my kids have never asked me to do that, but I’m sure if that happened, I’d be fine with it. But feet in general, I just, not your favorite. I just, well, I loathe feet. I don’t just, I don’t just say not my favorite. I don’t like feet. Like I open toe sandals, all that stuff. If somebody has gnarly, nasty feet and, and, uh, and I’ve seen people wear like sandals, flip flops, and then they like even put like their nasty feet up on a coffee table. I’m telling you, I’m ready to swing. Wow. I mean, I just, I’m just like, I literally can’t believe your nasty, crusty feet are on that table. So yeah, it’s, it’s really, it’s really bad for me. Now, however, that’s not, it’s actually not the reason why I don’t necessarily love that passage. Let me, let me, let me take away all of my feelings about feet. Let me take them all away. Okay. And just tell you this, So, and I said this right before we read this, is that my son, Stephen, my daughter, Tori, they went to Haiti on two separate occasions, and they did a foot-washing ceremony, and they said outside of their own salvation and baptism, that was the most spiritual experience they’ve ever had. It was the most meaningful, and it was wonderful. And they’ll even cry talking about it. Like, that’s how special it was. And I do believe that, by the way. I believe that anything, by the way, not just foot washing, anything can have that effect on you. Right? If you were to teach, like, for instance, the Passover meal. Have you ever been to one of those?

Jeff:
Juice for Jesus? Yeah, or a Seder meal. Yeah, we’re getting ready to do one with the elders.

Chris:
Yes, yes, yes. Now, you can experience that without any teaching and be like, I don’t even know what this is. Or you can spend an hour and a half learning the significance of everything on that plate and on that table, and then when you experience it, you could be overwhelmed to the point of tears. Because it is so special. Which, by the way, I’ve experienced. And it could be anything. So, washing feet, can be something that’s significant if you learn the significance of what it truly means. Because washing feet in and of itself is not special. It’s what it represents, right?

Jeff:
So unpack what does it represent?

Chris:
Yeah, so here’s the reason why I’m taking my emotions out of it, of me not liking feet. And I’m saying… Which I’m in agreement with you on. Yes, yes, yes. Okay. So it was, number one, washing feet in that day was something that everybody did all the time. because the roads were dusty and people wore sandals in the Middle East and they would be out a long journey or whatever, you know, working most likely. They would come in through a home and to sit down and not wash your feet. Not only was it, you know, it was actually ceremonial, right?

Jeff:
The exhaust that came from donkeys and camels was all over the street. Exhaust is my phrase, my delicate phrase. And so you’re walking in open shoes. You need to get that off your feet while you’re traipsing around inside the house.

Chris:
And let’s not forget also the tables were close to the ground. which means that they sat down on the floor oftentimes to eat. So it’s not like, you know, you sit at a restaurant table and your feet are just out of sight. You’re talking like your feet’s going to be touching somebody right there. And so washing feet was, we know this according to tradition, it was reserved for the servants, but not just that, but what? the lowest of servants, the lowest job, the lowest job on the totem pole. So if you’re in a really rich house and let’s just say you have three or four servants assisting the meal, the absolute lowest thing that you can do is wash somebody’s feet. Why? Because it was the most, you know, it was the dirtiest job. Yeah. Right. So therefore the symbolism doesn’t make sense today. Nobody washes feet today. We all have shoes and socks. The robes are paved, right? This is not customary. It’s not ceremonious, right? So therefore, a thing can be just as special to serve. What is the equivalent of serving another person today? What is the lowliest job? Because that’s why it was significant. It was significant that the savior of the world, the highest of high, would make himself to be the lowest of low. It just so happened that it was that tradition.

Jeff:
This was the best tradition. That’s right, that’s right. And they’re eating in a rich man’s home, and apparently the servants in the rich man’s home didn’t do it.

Chris:
Well, or Jesus insisted. Yeah. Hey, give me that towel. Yeah. Right. Because I couldn’t imagine him not providing that service for them. Right. But either way, I’m going to sneeze.

Jeff:
Oh, here you go. Oh, excuse me. Bless you.

Chris:
Thank you. He does. But and so do I. Thank you. Thank you. So anyway, the point is, is that is that so I have I have this thing where I don’t like feet. But more than that, I’m not against foot washing in a ceremony at all. I just hope that everybody understands that if you run into somebody, a part of a church that says, oh, foot washing is an ordinance in our church. Well, that’s fine. There’s nothing wrong with that. I mean, I guess you could argue that, but, you know, Jesus established communion, He established baptism. You know, you could make an argument and say foot washing is something that we do. That’s fine. I’m not going to get upset about that. I’m just saying it’s the only thing that’s irrelevant. It’s a hundred percent

Jeff:
In our culture, I mean, in other places in the world, they still have the same kind of situation. But in our culture… It’s true. And this is where I wanted to go with the conversation, is there are Nobody argues that Jesus expects his followers to get baptized, right? That’s an ordinance of the church. And then the other one is what we would call the Lord’s Supper or the Last Supper communion, right? Jesus said, do this in remembrance of me. He’s telling them, do this as often as you do it, do it in remembrance of me. Now, of course they would have done it often because they celebrate the Passover meal every year. Right? So every time you do this, I want you to remember me now, just understand that I’m the one. And so we’ve adopted that as an ordinance. This one, some churches would say, um, do as I have done to you, right? As we’re saying, so I want you to wash each other’s feet and people go, Oh my goodness, that that’s an ordinance too. We’re supposed to wash each other’s feet. The differences here, and it’s a significant difference. Jesus said in verse 15, I’ve given you an example to follow, right? So it’s not the ordinance of get baptized. It’s not the ordinance of observed communion or the Lord’s supper. This one is, follow this example. The most powerful person in the room served everybody else. That’s the example. And this was the, so he’s setting up an example here, not an ordinance. And there’s a big difference between those two things, I think. But hey, you can celebrate it. If it’s a deeply spiritual thing for you, I’m not going to wash your feet.

Chris:
If I don’t have to. I will never do it unless I’m in a situation where it would be an offense or rude to not do it.

Jeff:
I’ve had a couple times where people were doing it and it was a deeply spiritual thing for all of them and I’d always find a way to scoot out of it, you know, back before I was a pastor and stuff. But, you know, I think there’s other ways to serve. You can serve people and let them know I’m choosing to serve you and this is the way that Christians are supposed to be, is that we serve one another. And that really is, that’s what Jesus is saying here, is the example. The other big piece of this is Peter going, no, no, Jesus, I’m not going to let you wash my feet. And Jesus said, if I don’t wash you, you’re not even going to make it to the kingdom. And so there’s a humility in allowing it, right? And unless you’re humble enough to allow Jesus to wash you, you could never get to heaven. And that’s the other side of it. So it’s kind of funny, even Peter’s like, nah, dude, you’re not touching my feet.

Chris:
Yeah, well, I mean, and think about what it symbolizes, right? So Jesus dies on the cross to pay for our sins. right? So in a way, you can say it’s a foreshadowing because Jesus, not only does he serve humanity, but he’s about to serve humanity in a way that is the lowest that you can go, right? You’re going to serve. And so Jesus serves us in every way. And so when he says an example, I think the example has depth. I don’t think he did it for the purpose of saying the significance was me dying on the cross. I don’t think that. But what I’m saying is it’s an example of Jesus serving us. What does Philippians 2 say? He goes from the highest high to the lowest of low. He says, you know, not just any death, but even the death of the cross, right? So I think the concept of the Savior of the universe serving us is demonstrated in no greater way than him taking upon our sin and paying for it on the cross. And so when he says, hey, if I don’t wash you, then you have no part of me. And that’s what he’s really saying. He’s saying, if you don’t allow me to serve you, right, then you can’t be a part of me and my salvation. And by the way, let me just also say this, because I came down so hard on me not ever doing foot washing, I don’t want people to listen, right? So we have, I don’t know, sometimes roughly a thousand people a day that listen, right? So there are people around the world that listen that, you know, we may take in the wind out of their sails and be like, what? Chris or Jeff don’t like foot washing. And yet that’s one of the most special things in the world to me. It’s perfectly fine. It’s perfectly fine. Like I said, my son and my daughter, I mean, I can’t get any more than that, right? I mean, I honor and respect and love to even hear them talk about it. How special it was. How special it was. Which means, like, just because I personally don’t have a preference to do that, and I’m trying to, you know, unpack it in a way that says you can serve people other ways because of everything else. It does not mean that if that’s something that’s really special for you, maybe you’re a foot person, right? Maybe you love feet. I don’t know. Maybe you just richly it connects you to the action, the literal action that Jesus did. And so therefore that for you is really a connection, right? Because you’re wired that way for some reason. And that’s cool. I just, I don’t want to take away from somebody who says now, Chris, why are you busting on something that’s so important to me? Right. I don’t want to, I don’t want to take that away from anybody. Right. Right. So, so I’m just going to say, Hey, just because I don’t necessarily care for it. Uh, let me say it another way. If my team, which the team, the staff that I’m a part of, my team on my staff, if they were to come to me and say, we want to do a foot washing ritual and we want to do it at Heritage Church, I wouldn’t push back against that. I would have conversations with them about it. Are you sure you want to do it? But if they wanted to do it, it’d be totally fine. I’d put my stamp of approval on it.

Jeff:
Yeah, not against it, just don’t want to do it. Yeah, just to be clear. It’s your preferences and it’s because of, so there’s a note here in John 13 in the Life Application Study Bible. Imagine being Peter and watching Jesus wash the other’s feet all while moving closer to you. Seeing his master behave like a slave must have confused Peter. Mm-hmm, right? He still didn’t understand Jesus teaching that to be a leader a person must first be a servant This is not a comfortable passage for leaders who find it hard to serve others beneath them How do you treat those who work under you whether children employees or volunteers? That’s the message Jesus is trying to say.

Chris:
That’s exactly right

Jeff:
is you serve, the world thinks of it that the boss is above and everybody’s below. And Jesus said, no, the boss is the one, the leader is the one who comes in and serves from the bottom up. And so literally from the feet up. So Peter is confused by this, right? It’s a normal thing though. This would have happened for Peter every time he went into somebody’s home. That’s right. Every time he went into somebody’s home, somebody would have washed his feet. Yeah. Right? So it wasn’t a weird thing for him or an odd thing. It was completely and totally normal. This was not, the tradition of washing feet was not a distinctly spiritual thing. Right. At all. Jesus made this moment spiritual. Washing feet’s not spiritual, this moment was, because he was saying, look at this example. The example is, the greatest among us serve the rest of us.

Chris:
And by the way, I found a note here in the Life Application Study Bible, because I referred to Jesus dying on the cross. And it says, when Jesus responded, unless I wash you, you won’t belong to me, he may have meant, number one, that unless he washed away Peter’s sins by his death on the cross, then Peter could have no relationship with him, which is what I said. And then number two, that unless Peter submitted to him and allowed Jesus to minister in this way, Peter would never learn the lesson of humility. Either way, Peter seemed to grasp the significance of Jesus’s words, for he then wanted to be bathed completely And then it references what Peter said. Yeah. Yeah. So, so there it is. I wasn’t too far off there.

Jeff:
So, so that second meaning, you know, he says, you won’t belong to me. What he’s saying is you’re not, you’re not identifying with me, dude. If you refuse the humility that this requires, right. You’re never actually going to be one of my servants, right. So it’s not, he’s not saying heaven here. So some theologians would say it is a heaven thing. Cause he’s talking about the cross. I’m not sure I entirely believe that’s true, because it seems like he would have mentioned the cross, or his death, or my blood, and he doesn’t. So it seems like what he’s saying is, if you can’t identify at the servant level, you’re never going to identify with me. Right?

Chris:
Yeah, and I think that either way it works. But whether or not it’s probable or more likely, yeah, I’m totally fine.

Jeff:
So the big picture is, as we wrap up, the big picture is take Jesus’ example and serve the people around you.

Chris:
That’s right. That’s right. And then also to be overwhelmed always with the fact that our Savior not only taught this, but modeled this for us. And by the way, in a time where that was brand new information, because chances are you grew up and you’ve heard of servant leadership because Christianity has permeated throughout the centuries, right? So you’ve heard of that. It’s not a new concept, but imagine in the first century that was, like, you know, for somebody to say, don’t look down on a servant. In order to lead, you must be a servant first and last and exalted and humbled. All that was paradoxical and brand new information, even to love your enemies, serve your enemies, pray for them. That was brand new. So the unbelievable teaching here that Peter had to have wrapped his mind around and the others, we should never take that for granted because it’s a revolutionary concept. All right. Well, that’s all our time for today. And so hopefully we’ll see you next week on The Bible Guys.