Transcription

Connor:
You’re listening to The Bible Guys, a podcast where a couple of friends talk about the Bible in fun and practical ways.

Jeff:
Well, Chris, we’re back. It’s a new week.

Chris:
It’s a new week. We want to welcome every person who’s either listening or watching. Yes, that’s right. And we have just over half of the people who just listen on different, what do you call those?

Jeff:
We have quite a bit more people who listen on podcasts

Chris:
Yeah, podcast platforms like Spotify. Podcast platform, that’s the word I was looking for.

Jeff:
Yeah, like Spotify or Apple Podcasts or Spreaker, one of those. Yeah. And then, you know, less than that, that watch on YouTube. So yeah, very cool.

Chris:
It’s really cool. Thank you guys. Well, hey, today is Monday for us. And hopefully if you’re listening day by day, it is for you.

Jeff:
That’s right. Or whatever other day. Yeah, sure.

Chris:
Happy day. Yeah. You could stream.

Jeff:
That’s right. They’re binging. They’re binging on Saturday. Yes. I don’t know. Yes. So we always like to start off with a special segment and this segment is law or flaw.

Chris:
Yes.

Jeff:
So Chris is going to have to determine, I’m going to read a law or a flaw and Chris is going to have to determine which it is. And these are all Old Testament. So they are Levitical type laws or flaws.

Chris:
Okay. And the most common Old Testament law, they’re mostly all sort of scrunched into Leviticus. A lot of them. Yep.

Jeff:
Most of them. Yeah. So these ones would be. So it says, don’t eat animals with split hooves.

Chris:
Oh, well, yeah, that’s a Levitical law, which by the way, remember you and I had a conversation. It’s a flaw. Is it really?

Jeff:
Yes. You’re supposed to only eat animals that have split hooves that chew the cud. But you can’t eat animals that have split hooves that don’t chew the cud. Like a goat, they eat a sheep, they have split hooves. but they chew the cud so you can eat them. A pig has a split hoof but doesn’t chew the cud so you can’t eat it.

Chris:
So I get it backwards? So it’s a flaw. I get it backwards? Yes. Or is it like, are you saying it was written incomplete?

Jeff:
It’s split. It’s a split thing. But this one just flat out, it’s a ban. The question is, is it a ban to eat all animals with split hooves? And that’s a flaw. It’s not a ban, not all animals, only some animals with split hooves.

Chris:
That was a trick question. It’s sort of like a trick question.

Jeff:
It was a little bit of a trick question, but it was legit. Yeah.

Chris:
Wow.

Jeff:
Yeah. Leviticus 11 talks about that, that you can only eat the ones, you know. Okay. Yeah. Like a camel. You can’t eat a camel because it doesn’t chew its cud or whatever. Right. So anyways, here we go. Next, don’t plant two different kinds of seed in your field.

Chris:
Hmm. That sounds like something they would say. I know that there’s two different types of fabric. I’m going to say law.

Jeff:
Is it a law? Yes. Leviticus 19.19. Good job. Awesome. Yeah. Don’t trim your beard.

Chris:
Oh, we just talked about this. We just talked about this one.

Jeff:
That’s definitely a law. That is. It’s a law. Leviticus 19.27. Don’t leave anything in your vineyard.

Chris:
Oh, don’t leave anything in your vineyard. It seems like it should be a law, but I don’t remember it. Um, don’t leave anything in your vineyard. That doesn’t sound specific enough. The weird part about every law is I just remember it being so seemingly random.

Jeff:
So I’m going to start to talk yourself into circles.

Chris:
I’m going to say flaw.

Jeff:
It is a flaw.

Chris:
Oh, look at that. Yeah. There you go. Because the way it’s worded, don’t leave anything.

Jeff:
I would agree. Yeah.

Chris:
Yeah. Okay.

Jeff:
Yeah. Yeah. I should have said don’t leave excess or something, but yeah. Yeah. Okay. And then you’ve already referenced this one. Don’t wear clothing made of two different fabrics. Oh, that’s hilarious. That’s hilarious. I just said it. So that’s a lot. That’s a lot. That’s right. Leviticus 19, 19. Dude, I’m going to kind of give you, I’m going to give you a half a point on the trick question.

Chris:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So you got four and a half there. I was going to mention that, uh, remember, uh, we read several weeks ago about you strain for a nap, but you swallow a camel. That’s right. And then you were like, Oh yeah, I don’t think camels are. Well, I went back and looked and it is unclean. Right. That’s right. We’re not allowed to eat. Yeah.

Jeff:
It’s in that same chapter, Leviticus 11. Is it?

Chris:
Yeah. So, yeah, that’s pretty tricky, the way that you laid that out there for me.

Jeff:
Yeah, let me just read that little piece there, because it can be confusing to people, right? So, when God is giving the rules about what they can and can’t eat, he gives this big long rule about the kind of meats they can eat. And it says, give the following instructions, people of Israel, of all the land animals, these are the ones you may use for food. You may eat any animal that has completely split hooves and chews the cud. You may not, however, eat the following animals that have split hooves or that chew the cud, but not both. So the camel chews the cud but doesn’t have split hooves, so ceremonially it’s unclean for you. The hyrax chews the cud, but does not have split hooves, so it’s unclean. The hare chews the cud, but does not have split hooves, so it’s unclean. The pig has evenly split hooves, but does not chew the cud, so it’s unclean. Right? And then he goes on and he talks about other stuff. So basically, it’s sheep and goats.

Chris:
And cows.

Jeff:
Sheep, goats, and cows. That’s basically it. I think deer, you can eat deer, right? Venison, those things.

Chris:
But no camels? No more camels?

Jeff:
It’s pretty crazy how… Have you ever had a camel burger?

Chris:
Have I ever had a camel burger? No, I’ve not. I’ve had a bunch of weird things, but never camel.

Jeff:
Yeah, I had a camel burger in Fez in Morocco. Oh, wow. Yeah, yeah. It was really good.

Chris:
No. I would guess it’d be tough.

Jeff:
It’s not. It’s super, super good. Super good. Yeah. Anyways, that’s a weird topic, isn’t it?

Chris:
Yeah.

Jeff:
People are riveted. They are riveted right now.

Chris:
I just can’t believe these guys are talking about this stuff. We did a game show. I said this before the podcast started, but usually when you say laws from the Old Testament, usually people are referring to Levitical laws, or the 613, you know, all that, right? Uh, we did like this thing for Old Testament history, Bible history, and we did this game show and we studied as a floor. So our whole entire third floor Smith, uh, gathered up in the commons area. And we were like, and now the contestant number three. And then we were taking turns. We would see how long a person could sit on the seat for. And so we’d say like, you got five in a row. It’s like, And then the other person would go up, you know, and it was really fun, you know, and then I’m trying to know of the 613 laws.

Jeff:
Yeah. Yeah. And then law or flaw.

Chris:
Yeah. And we just studied them, which is how I, in Bible college. Yeah. In Bible college. Yeah. Right. Right. Hey man, you do what you can when, when it’s that kind of study.

Jeff:
That’s right. That’s right. We don’t have a TV in the dorm. That’s what you do for fun.

Chris:
Like, what do you do? What do you do for fun? We study for an exam.

Jeff:
Oh, okay. Good. Well, hey, in John chapter 15, we’re looking at all of these statements as Jesus is heading towards the cross. These are like all of his last words to his disciples before he gets arrested. They’ve already had the last supper, they broke the bread, they shared the wine, they sang their hymn, they head out, and they’re heading towards the Mount of Olives, and apparently they’re having this conversation as they’re walking along. And they stopped in a vineyard. That’s right. So Matthew chapter 15 verse 18, these are some of the last things he really wants his disciples to know. And he says, if the world hates you, remember that it hated me first. The world would love you as one of its own if you belong to it, but you are no longer part of the world. I chose you to come out of the world, so it hates you. Do you remember what I told you? A slave is no greater than the master. Since they persecuted me, naturally they’ll persecute you. And if they had listened to me, they would have listened to you. They will do all this to you because of me, for they have rejected the one who sent me. They would not be guilty if I had not come and spoken to them, but now they have no excuse for their sin. Anyone who hates me also hates my father. If I hadn’t done much miraculous signs among them that no one else could do, they would not be guilty. But as it is, they have seen everything I did, yet they still hate me and my father. This fulfills what is written in their scriptures, they hated me without cause. But I will send you the Advocate, the Spirit of Truth, and He will come to you from the Father and will testify all about Me. And you must also testify about Me, because you have been with Me from the beginning of My ministry. I have told you those things so that you won’t abandon your faith, for you will be expelled from the synagogues, and the time is coming when those who kill you will think they are doing a holy service for God. This is because they have never known the father or me. Yes, I’m telling you these things now so that when they happen, you remember my warning. I didn’t tell you earlier because I was going to be with you for a while longer. Okay. Well, that’s everybody’s favorite topic.

Chris:
Right. Yeah. Being persecuted, following Jesus when it’s going to cost you a lot. Yeah. And, um, you know, it, it’s, it’s interesting how, uh, remember when, remember when Peter, Jesus having a conversation with Peter and he literally tells him that you’re going to basically give your life for me. Like he says it in like a, in a pretty decently clear way. Right. And Peter still chooses to follow Jesus way back then. And then, you know, he just had a conversation a couple of podcasts ago where he actually said, what did he say? They said, we’ll follow you. We’ll even die for you. Right. And he says, I take the truth. You’re going to Peter, you’re going to deny me before the rooster crows twice. Right. And then he just goes on to say, now he’s telling them that people are going to persecute you. You’re going to receive persecution in the same way. Well, imagine this, you know, it always says after the resurrection, it makes references to the fact that then they remembered all the things that he taught. Then it made sense. You know, it’s a maturing of faith that comes later where we see that Peter does give his life, right? All the disciples give their lives. And This reminds me, honestly, I’m going off on a tangent, but just bear with me here. Go ahead. I had a really good friend who has been a Christian for a very long time, and he was even in ministry for years. And he just recently told me that he no longer believes. He no longer believes. He thinks that maybe Christianity is a crock. And this was a guy from the past. And I just absolutely blown away because, you know, if the disciples, there’s evidence, and he’s read these books. He’s done the studies. He’s seen that the disciples gave their lives. They didn’t make up the resurrection. They gave their lives, right? This is recorded in history. You know, you read Foxe’s Book of Martyrs. You read that? Yeah. You know, nobody gives their lives for something that they don’t believe in. And it’s recorded outside of the Bible, you know, in secular history that these gentlemen have all given their lives for what they believe. And I’m just thinking like, I mean, that plus a million other things. So anyway, all that to say, I’m talking about strength of faith. I’m talking about resolve and conviction to where you’re willing to pay the price for your faith because you absolutely know it’s true.

Jeff:
Right. The difference between, um, like today there are martyrs for other faiths because they believe that their faith is true. Right. Um, and that’s significant and there’s something about that, but, um, a Muslim, a radical Muslim martyr, you know, who wears a vest into somewhere and blows up a place or whatever. It does that because they’re absolutely convinced that what they believe is true. So a listener could say, yeah, but other faiths do that too. The difference is the reason why these guys died was because they were not saying, I believe it’s true. They died. These 12 died because what they were claiming was, I saw the resurrection happen.

Chris:
Right.

Jeff:
Right? So they died because they were not claiming… They were not saying, I believe because my pastor told me. Right. I believe because I read a book. They were not saying, I believe because that’s what our faith believes. They died because they said, I saw the risen Lord. I ran into the tomb and it was empty. And later Jesus stuck his hands out in front of me and said, go ahead, stick your fingers in the holes. I saw him. He made breakfast for me on the beach. in the Sea of Galilee after he rose from the dead. I watched him die on the cross. I saw him as the resurrected Lord. I watched him ascend to heaven. That kind of belief is very different from just saying, I read a book and a pastor told me, or I read a book and an imam told me.

Chris:
Right. And this is huge. And this is why I’m so flustered with my friend from the past who went to Bible college with me a long time ago, because I’m thinking of all the stories that I know in his life. I’m like, okay, what about that time when you told me this miraculous story that was like completely defy the odds where you saw God work beyond any calculable odds. Right. And then, and it was just, and it’s, it’s one of the most famous God stories that I know of. Right. And what about that? Right? Like, what about all these things that you’ve, you know, which is sort of, which is sort of that whole undeniable, I’ve experienced Christ kind of thing, right? Yeah. And, and I’m telling you, it’s just, it blows me away. But thank goodness that, you know, Well, I was going to say, thank goodness that we probably won’t have to decide whether we’re going to give our lives for our faith. You never know.

Jeff:
I just got off the phone right before I walked in here with a bunch of pastors in the Middle East who are saying, we want to plant churches, we want to lead people to Jesus, but we need to be careful where we do the training because it’s very dangerous for us. Excuse me. So yeah, you just never know. You never really know. You know, along those lines, we have our staff at Heritage Church reading a book called The Faith by Chuck Colson. If you’ve never read, if you want to read a fairly easy to read book about what Christians believe and why we believe it, The Faith by Charles Colston is a really good book. But Chuck was, before he became a Christian, he was Richard Nixon’s hatchet man. He ruined people’s careers. He ruined people’s lives. And that was his job. He was a really horrible human, right? And it was all about political power. So when Watergate happened, Richard Nixon had let everybody know, I’m the most powerful man in the world, I’ll protect you, just stay quiet, don’t say anything, right, all you insiders. But then the feds began to put the screws to Spiro Agnew, the vice president, and Agnew broke after just like a couple weeks. He gives up and he’s like, okay, I’ll spill the beans, and he spills the beans on everybody. Chuck Colson winds up going to prison. He says, Chuck said, the proof, the greatest proof to me that Jesus really did resurrect from the dead is that in my lifetime, the most powerful man in the world promised to protect us. The second most powerful man only had to keep his mouth shut and affirm a lie. That’s all he had to do and we all could avoid prison. And instead, the second most powerful man in the world was afraid the first most powerful man in the world wouldn’t protect him, and he rolled on all of us, and we went to prison. And Nixon lost his job as president. He said, so, when Bartholomew was standing there before the executors, and they were about ready to run him through with spears, or when they were about ready to cut off somebody’s head, or when they were gonna crucify Peter to the cross upside down, these things go, ha ha! I was just joking because they were given the opportunity to recant in many situations. Recant, just go back to worshiping the emperor because you’re Roman citizens. You guys don’t have to die. You know, some of them. And same thing for Paul. Paul was a Roman citizen. All he had to do was recant. Say, you know, I was making the thing up. I didn’t see the resurrected Lord. And he probably very likely would have avoided the death sentence. And so when you’ve got the most powerful people in the world rolling over on the president after just a few days, Surely one of the 12 would have done the same. Surely, right? Surely. When they’re faced with death, not just three years. I think Colston went to prison for like two or three years. They weren’t facing two or three years in club fed prison. They were facing death. And they looked him right in the eye and said, no, I cannot recant what I saw. I saw the resurrected Lord. That’s very different than just reading a book or being told by somebody, right? And so Chuck Colson said it was the single greatest evidence to him that what Jesus is, who he says he is, is because his followers died claiming that they saw him.

Chris:
That’s huge, right? Yeah, that’s really great. So I guess the application for us is, you know, what are we willing to, you know, sacrifice or whatever it costs us, are we willing to stand up for our faith? Because there are people out there who, their families, their entire families say, you know, because you’ve made this choice and you’ve converted to Christianity or you believe this, we’re going to disown you. And there are families who have to make this really painful choice, and they say, well, I can’t deny what I believe to be absolutely true, and I love my family, but I have to follow my Lord. And Jesus talks about that in other places, where he says, unless you choose me over your father and your mother, you cannot be my disciple. And so Jesus, you know, has to be our number one priority, regardless of circumstances or even family, as long as nothing conflicts with my faith. So I just want to, you know, just remind all of us today, like there are times where, you know, standing up for what is right is going to cost you maybe a relationship or maybe some favor with the boss, or you may be a refusal to do something that somebody asks you to do that goes against your conscience, that goes against your faith, and you know that it’s your boss asking you, and if you refuse to do it, it’s going to cost you, you know, and those are hard choices.

Jeff:
So Jesus says in verse 2 of chapter 16, for you will be expelled from the synagogue, right? To be expelled from the synagogue in the Jewish world was you were kicked out of society. Right. Completely expelled from society.

Chris:
Yeah, because it wasn’t just going to church. It was their way of life.

Jeff:
That’s right. This was their whole life centered around the synagogue. And so basically he’s saying you’ll lose your identity. You will lose everything. They’ll do it. And You know, that’s kind of surprising to the kind of Christian. And so I think we have to be careful sometimes how we preach. That God’s plan for you is to make your life so amazing and make all your wildest dreams come true. When in reality, Jesus says, hey, it’s not entirely that way. This is next level. Next level Christianity is they’re going to hate you because of me. There’s a really good chance. And so we are surprised and we feel like somehow God failed us because somebody said something harsh to us or something. You know, so here’s my caution to our listeners as we wrap up. Don’t be persecuted because you’re a jerk. Right? Sometimes Christians feel that they’re just mean in the way that they say what they say. And, uh, they, they feel like then when people react to them, that, you know, people are persecuting them. So he doesn’t say, I’m going to reward you for being a jerk, but he does say, if you’re like me, they’re going to hate you because they hated me. Right? So we need to be like Jesus. And if we’re like Jesus, and then they hate us because they see Jesus in us, we shouldn’t be surprised by that.

Chris:
Yeah. And we know that that is the lens in which he’s talking about because the very, uh, I was going to say the very next verse, it’s the previous verse of where you started was, uh, this is my command. Love each other. That’s great. So he just came off of talking about, this is how people will know. This is the evidence, how people know that you’re my followers, truly my followers. If you love one another, that’s great. So, well, that’s a great place to end and that’s our time. So we will see you hopefully next time on The Bible Guys.