Transcription

Connor
You’re listening to The Bible Guys, a podcast where a couple of friends talk about the Bible in fun and practical ways.

Jeff
Greet all our guests. Chris. Sure.

Chris
Welcome to the Bible, guys. He’s Jeff, I’m Chris and we love that you have tuned in here with us today. And today is actually Friday, which actually is going to be a very popular segment.

Jeff
Yes, because on Fridays, if all possible, we want to be able to celebrate with Chris about what Chris made Chris mad this week. Well, and this is our favorite segment. Yeah.

Chris
Well, it’s some people’s favorite segment.

Jeff
Oh, it’s everybody’s favorite segment.

Chris
I got to tell you something.

Jeff
I think it’s your favorite segment, to be honest with you. Is it. Well I said oh hey, today we’re doing what made Chris mad this week. You went, oh, I know I already got it. Yeah, I know.

Chris
But that’s not because it’s my favorite. It’s because literally this morning it happened. Oh okay. So I was I was at breakfast and I was meeting somebody for breakfast, a good friend. And we met at 830 at a very famous breakfast place in our area. It’s very, very famous. Awesome. It’s like my second office and don’t want to mention what it is. But anyway, I was positioned in the booth next to the wall and so he was facing toward the restaurant I was facing toward the wall. All right. And the thing that was hanging right above his head was crooked. Oh, now, let me tell you why this is a big deal.

Jeff
You couldn’t look away from it being crooked.

Chris
Let me tell you why this was a big deal. Because the entire wall was one big rectangular. It was like they’d carved out a rectangle. In the middle of that wall was a, like a like a window panes. It was one big rectangle. And in squares that were hers on a vertical. Right. And then they had three decorative things over here, three decorative things over here. And they were like, like, you know, like if you were to like, have a crate and you said, like Pepsi bottles in it. Yeah. You’ve seen those like that go through. Okay. Yeah. It was kind of like that on these wooden. Okay. So in other words it was a square with mini squares in it. Yes. Okay. And it was all on corrugated metal that had vertical lines on it. Yes. So everything about this, there was a lot of.

Jeff
Precision to this.

Chris
Thing. Everything was vertical up and down and and horizontal straight. Right. And everything was exquisitely straight. Everything except for one thing. And so it was like. It was like there was this big thing in the middle, one, two, three things. Everything has squares. This thing has squares, it’s vertical, it’s horizontal. And they have one, two, three. And the one thing that they had up there was crooked and it was significantly crooked. Right. And so I kept on staring at it. And the entire time I’m trying to ignore it, and I’m looking at it and I’m looking at him and he goes, what are you looking at? And I said, I just, I got to say this. I’m like, that thing is crooked. I’m like, please straighten that thing. Can you, can you reach up and straighten it? And so he leans over and he goes, oh, it’s bolted on. He goes, you can’t straighten it. And I said, okay, this. I go, you want to know what Chris made Chris mad this week? That thing on the wall right there, I was like, who decided when they built this restaurant to to have everything perfectly symmetrical, perfectly horizontal. And all of a sudden they hang this, and you know that dude and you know, that dude had a level and he didn’t feel like undoing it and straightening it. And he’s like, it’s good enough, right? And so I literally I walked to the to the cashier and, and then he was laughing about it, my friend Brian. And so my Brian looks at the lady and she goes, what are you laughing at? And he goes, I think he wants to see a manager. That’s what he says. That’s what he said. Oh, no. Chris
And then and then I said, no, I do not. And then she goes, why were you guys talking about? I’m like, fine. I’m like, know? Because he let the cat out of the bag and he said something like, something’s crooked. I’m like, fine, I got to explain it. So I explained it and I go, I go, listen, I know that’s not going to bother you, right? It bothers me, but I’m probably the only one that’ll ever mention it in the history of your working here. Right? And she goes, well, I care about those things greatly. So you’ve ruined my existence at this restaurant. She said. There is not a single time where I’m going to look at that, where I’m not going to look and see that that one thing is crooked. Yeah, yeah. And that made Chris Mathis.

Jeff
Well, you’re just passing it on to everybody else. So you need symmetry. You need things that I do too I yeah, I need symmetry, you need symmetry. So you can imagine how shocked.

Chris
Well if things are meant to be symmetrical. Yes. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So it depends like I don’t have to have symmetry but but if it’s, if it has to be symmetrical then make it symmetrical.

Jeff
So you can imagine. So symmetry is important to me. Balance level balance is important to me. Look having two sides the opposite sides of the stage balance out, all that stuff really matters to me. So you can imagine how shocked I was to find out that I have one ear lower than the other.

Chris
Yeah, listen, almost everybody does have one.

Jeff
Eye higher than another and one eye behind the other. Wow. And I’m like, don’t look at me. I’m hideous.

Chris
Monster, monster. Brian Regan, the Elephant man, um, human being. Yeah. And by the.

Chris
Way, that was exactly what he was referring to. Yeah, yeah, yeah, the the eye doctor said, you know, you have one eye lower than the other.

Jeff
Yeah, yeah.

Jeff
I was shocked, man. Yeah, that is true for me. So my glasses are always crooked. Yeah. Whenever I wear my glasses. Everything man. So just don’t look at me. Don’t don’t look me in the eye now because I feel like I’m being judged by you. Look. Way.

Jeff
That’s right. That’s so funny.

Chris
Well, anyway, that made me mad. And it made me mad on behalf of that restaurant.

Jeff
For all the other people with OCD.

Chris
Well, you know why? Because one guy who probably wasn’t even like he’s not the owner of the restaurant.

Jeff
No, no no, no. He’s some contractor.

Chris
He’s some contractor. One guy is like, oh, it’s okay. Only everybody’s going to see this for the life of the restaurant. He did.

Jeff
It. He did it. Like, I hope Chris comes to his restaurant.

Chris
Yeah, just.

Jeff
Just a little twisted.

Chris
I’m not certain that he knows my name. No.

Jeff
All right. I’m going to start trying to find all the other restaurants you go to, and I’m going to start messing with stuff on the wall. Well, you got to.

Chris
Do is look.

Chris
Oh, jeez.

Chris
I got to tell you, that would be horrific for me.

Jeff
Oh, that’d be funny.

Chris
If you did that.

Jeff
So we did that at my mom and dad’s house? Yeah, we went through the house, and in each room, we just turned one thing upside down. Oh, and just just left it that way just to see how long it would take. So it was like two days later, my mom called one of the paintings, we hung upside down and she called. She said, did you guys hang up? Hanging upside down? I said, oh yeah, we were just joking. And it was like every day she found another one somewhere else in the house. You know, that’s great. It was really funny. We do that sometimes too, or just mess with her because she likes things to be balanced to. Hey guys, this is the most amazing podcast ever and we know that. You know that. And so here’s what we want you to do. Like it. Give us a thumbs up. Leave comments about how amazing Chris is. And you’re going to let everybody else know that the Bible guys is worth paying attention to, and then make sure you share it with all your friends. Okay, well, here we are. We have how many verses here? 11 verses. Because remember yesterday Jesus says, well, you’re going to have to eat my eat my flesh and drink my blood.

Chris
Yeah. Or else have no.

Jeff
Part of me. Yes. Or have no part in me. And so. And he’s talking about accepting a sacrifice. Accepting me in. Right. Yeah, yeah. So here’s how they respond in verse 60, John chapter six, verse 60, many of his disciples said, this is very hard to understand. How can anyone accept it? Jesus was aware that his disciples were complaining. So he said to them, does this offend you? Then what will you think? If you see the Son of Man ascend to heaven? Again? The spirit alone gives eternal life. Human effort accomplishes nothing, and the very words I have spoken to you are spirit and life. But some of you do not believe me. For Jesus knew from the beginning which ones did not believe, and he knew who would betray him. Then he said, that is why I said that people can’t come to me unless the father gives them to me. At this point, many of his disciples turned away and deserted him. Then Jesus turned to the 12 and asked, are you also going to leave? Simon Peter replied, Lord, to whom would we go? You have the words that give eternal life. We believe and we know you’re the Holy One of God. And Jesus said, I choose the 12 of you, but one is a devil. He was speaking of Judas, son of Simon Iscariot, one of the 12 who would later betray him.

Chris
Do you remember the Waterboy? Football is the devil. Football is the devil, she said. She said, foosball, foosball, foosball, foosball, the devil. Everything was the devil. Yeah. And Dick Clark. Dick Clark is the devil anyway, so. So, yeah, I mean, think about the number of times where Jesus called somebody the devil. He said to Simon Peter, get thee behind me, Satan, remember? And then and then he says, hey, one of you is a devil. Yeah. And he’s speaking to Judas. And then later on when they’re, you know, we’re going to read this later, but when they’re in the upper room. Judas says, is it me? And he’s like, yeah, yeah, kind of remember yeah, yeah yeah, yeah. So he’s able to identify. Well there you go. But as of right now though, you know what I love about this I love how did I ever tell you this? When I was in Christology in Bible college, our professor was a study.

Jeff
Of.

Chris
Jesus of Jesus Christ. When I was in Christology, Dr. Pratt said, when Jesus. I don’t know if I’ve ever mentioned this to you before, but it stuck out my mind when Jesus was going through Samaria and he met the woman at the well, it says he had to go through Samaria. Yeah, there were a bunch of pastors kids in the room that talked about how Jesus knew that he had an appointment with the woman at the well, and Dr. Pratt’s like, no. Like there were many times where Jesus suppressed his his knowledge of these things, yada yada yada. And he said, Jesus just cut through some area because he didn’t see the need to go around it. So he was taking away any type of foreknowledge of who was going to meet him at the well. And there’s that whole thing where we know that Jesus sort of chooses to suppress knowledge because it literally says so at times. And then there’s times where it says he has incredible insight. He says he knew what they were thinking. Right? And so it always makes me teeter always on on that razor’s edge where I’m thinking, is this one of those things where he just knew, or is this one of those things like, like when Mary came to him at the wedding of Cana, was he shocked or did he say, hey, we ran out of wine? And he’s like, tell me something I don’t know, right? Right. Like like I can see right now in the back. Yeah. And there’s Lucy, right? Like like you see what I’m saying? So it’s like, so it’s like, you know, how much, how much knowledge of his omniscience, his omnipotent, all that stuff. How much did he suppress? Chris
Well, then there’s times like this where it says he knew which ones wouldn’t believe him and he knew which ones would. Which one would betray him. Yeah. And then I thought to myself, ah, that leads me to believe that he he had the knowledge, like he had spiritual insight and supernatural knowledge, pretty much of everyone around him. And that’s actually where I lean anyway. Isn’t that where you lean?

Jeff
No, I lean the other way. So. Yeah. Yeah, I’ve talked about this, I think before. I think that everything Jesus did, he did as a man through the power of the Holy Spirit. And so one of the spiritual gifts is knowledge. Another spiritual gift is prophecy. So the ability to see the future, the ability to supernaturally know things.

Chris
Oh wait, aren’t you saying the same thing I am? But I think it’s.

Jeff
I think it was the power of the Holy Spirit in him, not his deity. Because I believe Jesus said.

Chris
Okay, well, I mean.

Jeff
Jesus said, everything that I do, you’ll be able to do an even greater things.

Chris
Okay, so so here’s what I heard from you. I believe the exact same thing you do. Chris, I just believe in a theological distinction.

Jeff
Yeah, I think I think theological distinctions are important.

Chris
No, I’m not saying. I’m not saying they’re not.

Jeff
I don’t believe it was his deity that caused him to.

Chris
Know my topic was whether Jesus had the knowledge. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Not how he got it. Yeah.

Jeff
So I don’t know that. Yeah, yeah. So I think that when it’s pointed out that’s the miracle, I don’t think that it’s all the time everywhere.

Chris
Right. Okay. Okay. Right, right. So you believe I.

Jeff
Don’t think it’s any different for him than it would be for you if God gave you supernatural knowledge in the moment. You don’t have supernatural knowledge all the time. In this moment, if God chose to give it to you for this moment, you’d have it. That’s why I think it’s this moment.

Chris
Now wait a minute. If it’s no different, are you saying that it’s possible for a human to know which ones would believe, which ones wouldn’t, and which ones would betray him? Yes.

Jeff
What? That’s what the Holy Spirit can do.

Chris
Well, of course, the Holy Spirit can do whatever. That’s right. That’s what I’m saying. The Holy Spirit can stop this thing from hitting the ground. He didn’t choose to do that. Yeah, sure.

Jeff
But it’s not a spiritual gift to stop that from hitting the ground. What I’m saying is that the Holy Spirit empowers us. Just like he empowered Jesus. Yes. And that Jesus left his deity in heaven. He was God, yes, but he chose not to push his Godhead, right? That’s. That’s what? Sure.

Chris
That’s what Paul told us. It’s something that he so I believe that chose not to take advantage of.

Jeff
I believe that he functioned completely as a man of God, under the power of the Holy Spirit.

Chris
And not.

Jeff
In his.

Chris
Deity. I would say, had I thought it through before I asked the question without thinking it through, because all I was really trying to get at was his knowledge. Yeah, I would say I completely agree with that, right? However, because we don’t understand the intrinsic nature of how the father and the Holy and the son and the Holy Spirit work together, right? So, so because none of us are given any knowledge whatsoever about that. So, you know, there are definite times where Jesus just had the knowledge. He knew exactly what was going to happen. He knew what they were thinking. He knew what they were feeling. He knew, you know, everything. And so but I.

Jeff
Think that that knowledge was given to him and that ability was given to him because he had so many times when he went up in the mountain to pray. He had so many times when he fasted, he had so many times when he was was pulling away from the crowds and refueling spiritually. And he had so many of these. So we only see the one transfiguration moment right when he takes James and John and Peter up to the top of the mountain. But I don’t know what it means when it said he went up in the mountains to pray, or he spent the entire evening with his father, and then it was late at night, and then he comes back. I think that it was that refueling, spiritual refueling that gave him the ability because he recognized when power left him. Right, right. And so I think it was that spiritual refilling that gave him the, you know, the power of the Holy Spirit. And I think that that same kind of filling is available to us. So what I’m saying, I think that the Holy Spirit can give us supernatural knowledge in the moment, and to know that we have to turn left. I was just in Togo and Benin, and we were in a village that was completely consumed by by voodoo demonism. They had two demons outside the entrance to their village. They had a, a, the sacrifice tree, and they had all these things. It was really horrible. And one of the ladies in the Timothy Initiative, the Holy Spirit, she felt like, came to her in a dream at night and told her to go to this village. And she’d never heard the name of the village, but she had the spelling of the village exactly right. Jeff
Next morning she got up with and was speaking to one of the other Timothy’s and said, I feel like God wants me to go to this village. Would you come with me? The other lady said sure. They looked it up, found the village and went there. That was supernatural knowledge, but it was because they had been spending time in prayer, connecting to the father, filling up spiritually. And then the Holy Spirit said, okay, I’m going to give you the supernatural knowledge. We need you to go there. There’s a church there. Now, 80% of the village came to faith in Christ.

Chris
So, so.

Jeff
I think that’s the way that Jesus functioned.

Chris
Right? Okay. So I think I would have agreed with that if we were to sit down and write a paper about it. Yeah, yeah. But the thing that I hear that’s different, so that that’s sort of the same, but the thing that I hear that is different is what you’re saying is you thought you think that there are times where it sort of was there and then it wasn’t there, depending on how the need for it and how the spirit chose to reveal. Yeah, yeah.

Jeff
I think he lived his life as a human, and then the Holy Spirit would step in and give him supernatural ability. As we live our lives as humans, and the Holy Spirit steps in and.

Chris
Gives us a different way to say is it comes and goes right depending on God’s will. Right? Well, I mean.

Jeff
Depending on the necessity.

Chris
Yeah.

Jeff
Certainly Jesus wasn’t walking around 100% of the time doing miracles.

Chris
Right? Well, and that would be the same for the woman in Togo. It comes and goes depending on God’s will. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

Jeff
As God’s will needs to happen, he gives the knowledge that needs to be known. Yeah yeah yeah yeah.

Chris
Okay. That was a cool discussion.

Jeff
It was fantastic. I think those things are fun. It feels like semantics on the front end, but then you begin to realize there’s some really significant theological things, because if I read the Gospels and it’s everything Jesus does, he does only because he’s God. He did it to prove he was God. But what power did he? Did he have? Was this the power because he was God, or was this the power of God in him? Right. That’s that’s issue. Because if it was because he was God, then I’d just dismiss the whole thing and go, none of that’s available to me. Even though he says my followers are going to do greater things than I did. Or I can look at how Jesus functions as a man in his time away with God, his fasting, his prayer, his holy life, his time in the word. How often did he quote Scripture? All those kinds of things. Then those things are all available to me, as is the power of the Holy Spirit. Then when I flip out of the book of John and go into the book of acts, and I see this miraculous time, I don’t think that that’s just New Testament days. I think that’s Christianity. That’s how it’s supposed to be, right? That’s how I see. So I don’t see a gap between Matthew, Mark, Luke and John and the book of acts and 2023. I think that that power that was available in Jesus through the power of the Holy Spirit in him as a man, even though he was God in the flesh, in him as a man. The power of the Holy Spirit is the same Holy Spirit that we have. Thus the same power is there. And I had a missionary tell me one time, you know why you don’t get a lot of miracles? Jeff
He said, no. He said, because you don’t live a life that needs them. You want miracles for you. You want your family members to get healed. You want you want your life to be better, he said. But God’s mission is to seek and to save that which was lost. If you lived a life that was constantly, perpetually trying to reach lost people, you’d see more miracles. I think. I believe that’s true because that guy saw miracles all the time. Right. So I think there’s something in that. It feels like semantics, but there’s something very significant of. What were these things only because he was God? Or was this God in him?

Chris
Yeah. That’s awesome. We better get to this. This passage about deserting Jesus.

Jeff
Yeah, well, they bailed on Jesus we’ve been talking about. This is all the same story. This is three days of the same story, right?

Chris
It really is. It’s all.

Jeff
Still John. John goes all the way to verse 71 from verse 22, right? It’s all the.

Chris
Same. And it’s really just their reaction to what he just said.

Jeff
They’re like, you’re nuts, dude.

Chris
Because it starts off by saying this is hard to understand, which means it’s directly connected to what Jesus just said. And their conclusion was, how can anyone accept this? So and then he says, does this offend you? And by the way, that that is a that is a you know, there’s a sermon in there too, right? Because the Word of God is offensive when it goes against what we want selfishly. Right? Yeah. Right. So if we want to, that’s.

Jeff
Not how I want God to work in my.

Chris
Life. You know, it reminds me of it reminds me of the end of Guardians of the Galaxy one where where Rocket Raccoon says, so what if I. Kill somebody and he goes, would that be murder? And he goes, but what if I want it more than they want it, sir? I just said, I want it more than they want it. And he’s like, that’d be still a crime still, right? And so it’s like it’s like it’s really funny, but but that’s sort of.

Jeff
Morality to change based on what I need in the moment.

Chris
But I said I wanted it more, sir. Didn’t you hear me? So it’s like it’s like whatever we want. And then God’s word comes along and says, this is my word. This is what I want you to do or say, or how to believe or how to act. Sometimes if we don’t like that, it’s really offensive. Yeah. And just like yesterday or two days ago when I preached, I preached at James chapter one and it says, consider it all. Consider it pure joy when you consider trials of many kinds. And you’re like, well, that’s sort of borderline offensive.

Jeff
Yeah, no, thank you. Because I’ll pass on that one.

Chris
Right? Because you don’t know what I’m going through. God, even though he does. And so it’s kind of the same thing. Well, you know, again, this is this is Jesus just, you know, saying, does this offend you? Right? And of course, it offends you. Right?

Jeff
So, so the notes in the Life Application Bible, verse 66 and 67 are fabulous. It says, why did Jesus words cause many of his disciples to desert him? One they may have realized that he wasn’t going to be the conquering Messiah King they expected. This is where he pivots to going, no, my kingdom is a spiritual kingdom, right? Right. So so he’s he’s shifting here to. He refused to give in to their self-centered requests. Hey, we want more food and teach us how to do these miracles, right? Three he emphasized faith, not deeds, and that was contrary to their religion, for his teachings were difficult to understand and some of his words were offensive. As we grow in our faith, we may be tempted to turn away because Jesus lessons are difficult. Will your response be to give up, ignore certain teachings, or reject Christ? Instead, ask God to show you what the teachings mean and how they apply to your life. Then have the courage to act on God’s truth. And sometimes it takes a lot of time. It’s not just like God. Show me the meaning. I don’t know the meaning. I give up on it, right? It’s over years of of walking with God. And then verse 67, where he goes, now, are you guys going to leave me too? The note says there is no middle ground with Jesus. I love that phrase. There is no middle ground. It’s not like, oh, almost, good job you’re trying. He doesn’t do that right. There is no middle ground with Jesus. When he asked his disciples if they would also leave, he was showing that they could either accept or reject him. Jesus was not trying to repel people with his teachings. He was simply telling the truth. Jeff
The more the people heard Jesus real message, the more they divide into two camps. The honest seekers who wanted to understand more, and those who rejected Jesus because they didn’t like what they’d heard and they weren’t getting what they wanted. Right. I love those two notes. Those are. That’s really the whole point of this passage, quite honestly, of I think the whole all those, what is it, 50 something verses we read over the last three days? Yeah. Is that either you’re for me or against me, you’re with me or not. Why are you really here? Because of course, there’s going to be things you don’t understand.

Chris
Yeah. That’s great. Well, that’s probably a good place to end. Our time is up. So are you for Jesus or are you against Jesus? And there is no middle ground. Yeah.

Jeff
And you don’t have to understand it all. You just have to decide, are you with me or against me?

Chris
And it’s sort of like I just mentioned two days ago, I preached James chapter one. The very next verse after it gives the hard truth, says, if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask. Let him ask of God, and he’ll give it to you freely. Yeah, right. So, Lord, help me to understand this. Yeah. Which is good. That’s a good, that’s a good.

Jeff
That’s fantastic. Chris.

Chris
All right, well, hey, we’ll see you hopefully on Monday on The Bible Guys.